Older AVR, Surround Placement, Audiophile Debate

HDMI-less
My father-in-law had a home-theater system installed a couple of years ago and would like to add a Blu-ray player. He asked me to hook it up, but I'm running into a problem with his system. The receiver is a Yamaha RX-V659, which only has component-video switching. I want to avoid running a separate HDMI cable to the TV and having him switch sources on the TV and receiver separately. Will connecting a Blu-ray player via component video cause the player to downconvert copy-protected disks to 480i? Do the majority of Blu-ray titles have HDCP?

Rusty Richards

I agree that having to switch both the TV and AVR is a pain, though this problem can be mitigated by a good universal remote, such as the Logitech Harmony One. Most Blu-ray players will send no more than 1080i via component, but they won't downconvert Blu-rays to 480i, even with HDCP, which is found on virtually all commercial discs. Even so, sending 1080i via component won't produce the best possible picture, since the content on most Blu-rays is encoded at 1080p, so the player must interlace it and the TV must then deinterlace it, probably resulting in artifacts.

Also, your father-in-law won't get the full benefit of the new audio formats without HDMI unless the Blu-ray player has multichannel analog-audio outputs connected to the AVR's multichannel analog-audio inputs, which requires six or eight cables just for audio.

The best solution is to get a new AVR with HDMI switching, but short of that, I would probably send HDMI to the TV and multichannel analog audio to the receiver and switch both using a universal remote. If you connect the player's component output to the AVR, he'll still see high-def, but the image could well have visible artifacts.

You're Surrounded!
I have seen many websites (including Dolby's and THX's) dictate where the surround speakers should be placed laterally, but few provide any guidance about where they should be placed height-wise. Should the tweeters be placed at ear height, or should they be above one's head? If they are above one's head, should they be tilted down to the main seating positions? I'm using B&W 685s as my surround speakers.

Gonzlobo

According to THX, direct-radiating surround speakers such as yours should be mounted fairly high up on the wall (maybe six feet above the ground) just behind the listening position and pointed at each other, not at the listener, in order to create a diffuse, enveloping surround soundfield with movie soundtracks. Dipole/bipole side-surround speakers should be mounted a couple of feet above seated ear height with the null region pointed toward the listener.

Endless Debate
I know this subject was endlessly debated a decade or so back, but for the benefit of those of us who have only recently come to home theater and "more than iPod" audio, is it possible to get audiophile quality stereo out of a home theater setup?

I'm not talking about the extremes—clearly, there is equipment at the far end of the audio rainbow that exceeds anything in home theater. My question is aimed at the moderate and budget listener. Could I take, say, five PSB Alpha B1s, marry 'em to an Onkyo or Denon receiver, get decent home theater performance and still be able to enjoy pure stereo?

Scott Atkinson

I'm sure the audiophile community would still say that high-quality 2-channel performance is not possible with a home-theater system, and I agree that the two types of systems are optimized for different tasks and thus cannot serve the other task optimally. But enjoyment is in the ear of the beholder. I'm happy listening to 2-channel material on my home-theater system (PSB speakers, Pioneer AVR). Does it sound as good as a megabucks 2-channel rig? Of course not, but given the amount of 2-channel listening I do (not much), my system is perfectly adequate for me. Only you can decide if you can be happy under those conditions.

Long-time audiophile Tom Norton has this to say about the subject:

I don't agree that it's impossible for a single system to serve both tasks, but to do so, you must build the system carefully. For example, a set of high-end 2-channel speakers will not make the best system for movies if the center-channel speaker provided by the manufacturer does not match the tonal quality of the left and right, as is often the case. A modest A/V receiver might provide a great home-theater experience, but it cannot match the audio quality of the best separate preamp and power amp. A surround pre/pro might not match the sound of the best 2-channel preamp, but you can get around this by using a great preamp between the pre/pro and power amps. Use the 2-channel preamp directly with 2-channel sources and run the left and right signals from the surround pre/pro through it for movies, using a known fixed setting in the preamp or choosing a preamp with a fixed gain/bypass mode specifically designed for this purpose.

If you have a home-theater question, please send it to scott.wilkinson@sorc.com.

COMMENTS
Audio_newb's picture

I think it would be interesting for the magazine to do a feature on the last topic. Specifically, I'd love to see a feature comparing everything from a mid priced receiver to 2 channel setup to a pre/pro setup. Clearly the prices would vary greatly, but I'd like to hear what the editors have to say about sound quality/ bang for your buck at different levels of the price curve.Also, I'd just like to put in my 2 cents and say that another option for the last question is to consider just moving to a 2 channel setup. For many years I swore by my 5.1 setup, but upon moving to a smaller apt decided to go 2 channel for everything and haven't looked back. Less components means you can spend more on what's there, and the lack of wiring/ placement headaches is a great bonus. You might be surprised at how little you miss an ht rig with a great sounding 2 ch setup.But again, look at how you will use the system. I listen to a lot of music in addition to movies.

George's picture

It is possible to get great 2 channel audio from one system if you have separates amp/pre amp. I have a set of B&W speakers a Rotel amps using a yamaha rxv1800 as my pre amp and both surround sound and 2 ch stereo sound great. (Yamaha's pure direct mode is awesome for hifi)

mark's picture

My Dish VIP612 and Yamaha RX-V465 have a HDCP handshake problem that causes the picture on the tv to flash on and off (no piture problem with VIP612 connected directly to the tv via HDMI cable). Is there a way to tell which component is at fault?Another tid bit of information - I just switched from Direct TV to Dish. I did not have this problem with the Direct TV satelite box and the Yamaha AV receiver.

Jerry Gascey's picture

I just purchased a Sony STR-DN1000. After owning one denon receiver and two Onkyo receivers I decided to give Sony a try with it's latest one. I have four ss-f5000 towers and the cn5000 center speaker along with a yamaha subwoofer. When I ran the auto-calibration it set all my speakers at 120hz. Should I go back in and manually set them to 80hz so the subwoofer can handle the low frequencies. The auto-calibration also set my fronts and surrounds to large. Should I set them to small as well? Please give me your best opinion on the Sony STR-DN1000 as well.ThanksJerry Gascey

Jonathan Hilton's picture

Rusty Richards, Does your father-in-law's television screen have a digital audio output and does your receiver have digital audio input? If so try connecting the digtal audio output from your screen to the receiver. I did this with my setup and this works quite well. 42LG60 screen, XBOX 360, Samsung Bluy Ray player, and Sunfire surround sound processor.

CJLA's picture

I have a regular size living room. We love watching movies in 5.1 & for the most part it sounds pretty good. I have (2) chairs close to each other on one wall for 'small conversations', and a couch on the opposite long wall. The TV is on one short wall, and the fireplace on the other short wall. My coffee table IS the sweetspot! If I want to listen to 2-channel I would have to sit on my coffee table!Solution 'A' would be to rearrange my living room into a theater where the seats are in the middle of the room... Not gonna happen! It's just not practical. Solution 'B', get a killer USB DAC to interface w/my high resolution CD library on my PC and a killer set of headphones and lie on my comfy couch! Just wanted to let you guys know that there is another way.

Scott Wilkinson's picture

Jerry, I would manually set the crossover to 80Hz and the speakers to "small." As for the Sony AVR, see HT's review here:hometheatermag.com/receivers/sony_str-dn1000_av_receiver/

Scott Wilkinson's picture

Mark, from what you describe, it's something in the interaction between the sat receiver and Yamaha AVR, since the problem doesn't occur when you connect the sat receiver directly to the TV, and it didn't occur with a DirecTV box. I suspect there may be nothing you can do about it until and unless Dish updates the firmware to solve the problem. Have you contacted Dish about it? They might have a documented history of this problem with the RX-V465 or other Yamaha AVRs.

quad-gradientsetup's picture

Hi Scott,

I hope you can help me.… I'm looking to invest in a pair of monitor audio silver fx surrounds to use in a 5.1 system, but I'm confused as to where they should be placed…
My room is fairly square but my sitting position is only about 1 foot away from the rear wall. Also the side walls only extend forward 2 feet from the rear wall either side of the listening position, so i'm assuming side mounting is not possible as the speakers can't be placed far enough from the rear wall to avoid reflections. The silver fx's are switchable for either bipole/ dipole but unfortunately I can't experiment as the room is being decorated so is completely bear and I need to chase the cables in the walls before the system is set up. Not ideal but that's why I need some advise…
Not sure if placement in the corners facing the listener is advisable…
If you could advise on approx measurements, (height, distance apart and which mode they should be in) or anything else i may need to know it will be most appreciated…

Thanks and best regards

Simon

Sent from my iPod

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